Seriously, this was a great post, and I agree; I love being a part of rag tag group that triumph. Gratz on killing the great LK…again.

It was the dragged out time between wipes that really got to me. I think when you truly don’t think you’re going to kill a boss you drag your feet to try again. Shame these guy were thinking like that – they were so wrong!

Most of the people in this 10 man were 19-20ish guys. I think they were too worried about looking silly to scream in excitement over vent.

I have to tell you it really was one of the best experiences I personally had in this game for a very long time. We wiped for a couple of hours, but we had progression on almost every attempt and we finally killed him after 3 or 4 hours.

The people in this group were ecstastic with the kill, and were truly grateful for the raidleading via Papa and the dps I brought to the group.

I personally am not in favor of carrying people or charity runs, but I didn’t get that feeling at all from this. This group worked hard for it, focussing on assignments, and trying really hard to just *survive* phase changes etc.

I think the biggest diffrence between the experience you had and mine was there was no verbal abuse at all in our run, and they were very respectful to each other in regards to promptly running back and not going afk.

This is a fantastic post – to be honest, it’s the ill-mannered challenges of pugs that make them so frustrating to me. I don’t mind lack of experience, a low gearscore, multiple wipes or any of that stuff, but I hate the idea that you’d be stood around waiting for 30 minutes while the MT ate dinner. I mean that’s my *time*, you know? I would never dream of doing that, I get angsty enough when I need a bio break But maybe that’s just because I’m English.

I pug quite a lot these days, but I pug with my guild, if that makes sense. I find if you can out-number the pugees you can usually create, and maintain, the atmosphere. I think it’s a safety in numbers thing.

I’ve certainly never taken anyone to ICC who hasn’t been there before, but I have taken people further than they have been before (oo-er). Generally I find people are really excited to down the later bosses, not necessarily the LK (since I don’t quite have enough experience to lead a pug through that myself), but even things like the Blood Princes and the Prof.

By, yes, congratulations – your determination, tenacity and patience put me completely to shame. I would have been out of there like a whippet when the tank couldn’t be arsed to show up.
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And I think one of the problems with raiders right now is that most of them aren’t used to wiping (me included). I spent 4 hours on Sunday doing 2 hardmode bosses (with attempts on 2 others) in Ulduar 25 and I have never wiped so much in my life. And every time we wiped, someone would bail (or the RL would kick someone who had demonstrated an inability to follow simple instructions over multiple attempts) and we’d have to go get someone else from Dal.

Even my guild will try a hardmode boss only a few times before doing it on normal and moving on to the next one. There’s gear upgrades on some of the ones we move on to though, so that’s part of it. Also, heroic Saurfang on 10 man is evil. Just saying…
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